Clutch/Flywheel advice for 1.8

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ianoz
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Clutch/Flywheel advice for 1.8

Postby ianoz » Sun Jan 19, 2020 12:20 am

Time has come for a new clutch, so it's a good excuse to sneak a lighter flywheel past she-who-must-be-obeyed.. 8) Researching has left me with as many questions as answers though, and any tips would be great..

Application;
NB8B,
- not street dríven, only trailered to club track days so driveability doesn't matter
- stock engine, T2 4.44 diff.
- longer term plan is some mild mods, about the furthest would be head and cams on a stock bottom end - so mild power and stock rpm's.

One option, and the one I'm leaning towards, is to change to a 1.6 flywheel/clutch combo - which should hold OK, and is just a drop-in replacement as best I can tell. There's some pretty wild units on here running 1.6 clutches...


> I'm thinking a HD organic disc would be OK - are there any actual negatives in going up to a cushioned ceramic or a button at this level (just overkill?)

> suggestions on brand of flywheel and clutch/pp? :D (or which ones to avoid!!)
Brandwise Exedy, or I've heard Xtreme are OK. I know Direct Clutch do really good kit, but I think that would be an overkill dollar-wise for a basically stock build.

> this 4.5kg flywheel is just over $300AUD landed. Any experience with this brand? At least it's USA manufactured rather than a chinese knockoff...
https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/CLUTCHMAX-10-LBS-PROLITE-CLUTCH-FLYWHEEL-for-MAZDA-MX-5-MIATA-EUNOS-ROADSTER/133108805819?hash=item1efde730bb:g:MZcAAOSwPW9dJqlz

They also do flywheel/pp/disc combinations for under $400 landed - they're an unknown to me.. but that's a darn sight cheaper than adding a separate pp/disc. Only about $20 extra for a sprung ceramic button plate instead of the organic one.
https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/STAGE-2-PERFORMANCE-CLUTCH-KIT-LIGHT-FLYWHEEL-for-90-93-MAZDA-MX-5-MIATA-NA-B6ZE/132963343353?hash=item1ef53b9bf9:g:g9kAAOSwiJRd88tG

> any hidden issues I've missed with running a 1.6 clutch setup on a mild 1.8? eg 1.8 slave cylinder and lever OK?, any silly ring-gear differences between any years/countries? Unobtanium bolts that don't fit?


Other option is to just drop a 1.8 assembly in.
The 1.8 flywheels often seem to be lighter than a 1.6, but I'm not sure that the rotational mass would actually be less with the wider clutch disc and pressure plate bolted up. I'm assuming that for the same flywheel dead-weight, that a 1.6 will be 'lighter' overall than a 1.8 setup, but haven't been able to determine a cross-over point. Finding spec's on the rotational inertia is 'challenging' - they all just quote dead weight.. and there's not much published on disc/pp weights at all :evil:

Sorry for the long post - but any pointers would be gratefully received!
NA6 '89 red, NB8B '01 silver

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RileyR
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Re: Clutch/Flywheel advice for 1.8

Postby RileyR » Sun Jan 19, 2020 5:58 am

I have an na8 and recently put in a 1.6 hd organic clutch and a 4kg flywheel. Feels good. light clutch pedal, but fairly bitey. Maybe with the extra hp in the nb8b you might want a harder clutch? Im not sure.

I see no negatives to the 1.6 setup, its cheaper, its lighter, the rotating mass is closer to the centre (smaller diamater). If turbo cars run them then they can hande stock 1.8 power surely.

Mx5mania have their flywheels back in stock i think for $500



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1996 BRG NA8

RS2000
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Re: Clutch/Flywheel advice for 1.8

Postby RS2000 » Sun Jan 19, 2020 11:09 am

Have a talk to Automotive Plus (MX5 Plus). They were a forum sponsor. Now?

Back in Feb 2015 I bought, at their suggestion, a 1.6 Sports Organic Hi-torque clutch kit (4kg) with a 1.6 Chromoly flywheel (4kg) for my NB8A track car (standard engine except for intake & exhaust). It's still great after five years of supersprints & some hillclimbs, with good feel, light pedal & of course the freer rev building.

The clutch kit was $430 & the flywheel $350 back then.

ianoz
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Re: Clutch/Flywheel advice for 1.8

Postby ianoz » Sun Jan 19, 2020 9:44 pm

Thanks guys Good to know the 1.6 is ok without any gotcha's lurking to bite me when fitting it :D

Automotive Plus weren't showing any NA/NB flywheels on their site, but I'll give them a call tomorrow to see if they're still available. I've always liked their kit - have bought it before.

(now to convince the wife that I really need a 2-post hoist so I don't need to lay on the ground. more chance of winning lotto though I think)
NA6 '89 red, NB8B '01 silver

rascal
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Re: Clutch/Flywheel advice for 1.8

Postby rascal » Mon Jan 20, 2020 6:54 am

ianoz wrote:(now to convince the wife that I really need a 2-post hoist so I don't need to lay on the ground. more chance of winning lotto though I think)

Just keep showing her all the fail videos on YouTube of people jacking their cars and it falling off, trapping them underneath, and mention that might happen to you one day but not if you had a hoist, it’s a safety thing.... :D

Unless she’d be happy to get rid of you :shock: and then you may need a different approach...!

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PaulF
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Re: Clutch/Flywheel advice for 1.8

Postby PaulF » Mon Jan 20, 2020 9:56 am

An Exedy Heavy Duty designed for a 1.6 will have no issues taking the torque from an atmo 1.8 and will be nicer to drive around the pits, on and off the trailer etc than the Sports Organic. I'd be getting the lightest flywheel I could, but no need to get a super heavy duty clutch if you're not going to be producing massive torque. You'll just make the car harder to drive for no reason.

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bruce
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Re: Clutch/Flywheel advice for 1.8

Postby bruce » Mon Jan 20, 2020 7:27 pm

Because people like to install a cool sounding clutch behind their 100hp beast.

ianoz
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Re: Clutch/Flywheel advice for 1.8

Postby ianoz » Tue Jan 21, 2020 12:18 am

1.6 HD it is then :) Now to hunt down a flywheel..

Thanks all.

rascal - i'd better check if there's a life policy i don't know about.. :o
NA6 '89 red, NB8B '01 silver

ianoz
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Re: Clutch/Flywheel advice for 1.8

Postby ianoz » Fri Feb 14, 2020 10:19 pm

A box of goodies arrived today :D

4kg NA6 flywheel and Exedy organic HD from Automotive Plus.

now to make time to fit them!
IMG_0909.JPG


- and a big thankyou to Brendan for the dimensions file for a main seal tool. Lathed one up from a kg of steel :lol:
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
NA6 '89 red, NB8B '01 silver

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CrazyRacer
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Re: Clutch/Flywheel advice for 1.8

Postby CrazyRacer » Thu Feb 20, 2020 2:52 pm

rascal wrote:
ianoz wrote:(now to convince the wife that I really need a 2-post hoist so I don't need to lay on the ground. more chance of winning lotto though I think)

Just keep showing her all the fail videos on YouTube of people jacking their cars and it falling off, trapping them underneath, and mention that might happen to you one day but not if you had a hoist, it’s a safety thing.... :D

Unless she’d be happy to get rid of you :shock: and then you may need a different approach...!

I successfully used this argument. Best addition I've ever made to the workshop

Image

ianoz
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Re: Clutch/Flywheel advice for 1.8

Postby ianoz » Fri Feb 28, 2020 7:58 pm

Got asked for the weights of the components so postimg them here for reference;

4020g Flywheel (without spigot bearing) Unknown brand - but from Automotive Plus
3516g Pressure Plate Exedy MZK6944HD
969g Disc Exedy MZD053UAF

both Exedy PP & disc are marked made-in-japan (in case there's different sources).


Haven't installed them yet (life got in the way) so no reports on usability.


Still working on the hoist... hope springs eternal in the heart of the downtrodden husband :roll:
NA6 '89 red, NB8B '01 silver

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CrazyRacer
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Re: Clutch/Flywheel advice for 1.8

Postby CrazyRacer » Sat Feb 29, 2020 7:55 pm

Yep, asked by me and for extra reference here's the weights on the equivalent 1.8 parts (only not as precise)

NB8A 1.8 standard flywheel: 7.9kg
Xtreme FMZ002CL 1.8 flywheel: 4.7kg
Exedy Sports Tuff MZK-6964HD 1.8 Clutch Pressure Plate: 4.2kg
Exedy Organic dríven Plate: 1.1kg


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