Coilovers vs Shocks/Springs

[Mactype]

I would advise purchasing from a Fulcrum Distributor, as lots of TEIN units are sold set up for Japanese roads. Just a little different to Australian conditions.

How are they different?

[StanTheMan]

If you want a stiff car & lowered look konis & kings & also change all your bushes with polyurathane.
If you want a quality ride get something better.
Don't get me wrong Koni & Kings can help make a weapon out of a car provided it is set up correctly & complimented by some decent tyres a good wheel alignment & LSD.
It will be a far superior ride to the standard set up. But when you hit bumps......they will tend to clunk. as oposed to rattle which it may do now.
Better quality shock setup will feel just as firm as the Koni & king set up however the difference is when you hit bumps. rather than getting clunks you will get bumps & probaly not feel the as hard as with the lesser Koni King combo. The cunking may also vary a little depending on how stiff the tire sidewalls are & tyre pressure you are running.
the big disadvantage of this package is the suspension travel. make sure you cut the bumpstops with this one


Coil over......I'm getting old....... I'm starting to require some comfort.But I still want performance. For me If I was to upgrade my King/Koni set up.....I wouln't do anything less than the Bilstein PSS9's

But thats another 1K on top of what you are really willing to spend.

[Matty]

In general, the benefits of a coilover are that:
a) the damping rates are matched to the spring rates (though Jap setups are usually very stiff in the damping).
b) the height is adustable so you can corner weight (which is overkill for most people)
c) sometimes (eg Teins) the shock bodies are shorter, so there's more bump travel.

By the time you price up Kings, Konis and a set of short bumpstops, you're very close to the price of a set of coilovers (eg the SS) anyway. That said, (unless the Fulcrum specs are different) I think the rear spring rates on the Teins are way too high.

[Casey]

To be technically correct, any spring/damper combo fitted to an MX5 is a coil-over. Literally a coil-over is a damper with a coil spring mounted concentrically such that they form a single unit (coil-over-damper).

What is commonly called a coil-over is a very high quality adjustable damper (usually) and concentrically mounted spring matched unit fitted with an adjustable spring platform to adjust ride height and corner weights.

Something like the rear suspension in a Mazda 6, where you have the spring and damper seperated, is not a coil-over.



Anyhoo - the Koni dampers with Eibach springs are well worth a look. A much better option then King springs for only a little extra cost.

[Casey]

I would advise purchasing from a Fulcrum Distributor, as lots of TEIN units are sold set up for Japanese roads. Just a little different to Australian conditions.

How are they different?

Didn't Fulcrum do a lot of testing and specify dfferent valving for the Aust spec Teins to make them more suitable for local conditions?

[Babalouie]

I would advise purchasing from a Fulcrum Distributor, as lots of TEIN units are sold set up for Japanese roads. Just a little different to Australian conditions.

How are they different?

Didn't Fulcrum do a lot of testing and specify dfferent valving for the Aust spec Teins to make them more suitable for local conditions?

I think they're referring to getting japan-spec Teins from a grey mkt importer (which is quite cheap nowadays given the weak yen...) vs getting the Aussie-tweaked Teins from Fulcrum/Mania etc

[Brad]

At the tech night, Fulcrum described how Tein flew an engineer out and they tested and tuned the SS's for a series of cars for local roads. Fortunately the MX5 was one of these. I understand the Tein then made the coilovers to these specification back in Japan and exported them to Fulcrum who distribute.

[ZenArcher]

David and Daniel at MX5 Mania installed a set of Teins on my MX5 last year in December.

Now after 10 months use, they are worth every cent. No, I don't go out to the race track, so some of you might think this is a wast of money for the road. But the road handling/holding and comfort levels are like nothing else I have ever had under any of the variouis modified cars I have owned over the years. (I am 40yrs old and have owned several Celicas, RX-7's, several SS Commodores, Triumph TR-7... the list goes on)

The teins are great, handling is excellent, but it isn't bone jarring when you hit bumpy areas on the road. The adjustability is also really good, you can feel the difference even 2 clicks make. Also the advantage of having height adjustability too. Which is the reason I had to get them in the end as I got done for having my MX5 5mm too low - the shocks had previously been replaced, but the springs had sagged.

I am currently using the new Bridgestone Adrenalin tyres - excellent... heaps better than the goodyears I had on previously. The goodyears were only 1/2 worn and they were letting go in the wet around corners without even trying at 40kph.

Anyway, just my 2c worth.

[pcmx5]

David and Daniel at MX5 Mania installed a set of Teins on my MX5 last year in December.

Now after 10 months use, they are worth every cent. No, I don't go out to the race track, so some of you might think this is a wast of money for the road. But the road handling/holding and comfort levels are like nothing else I have ever had under any of the variouis modified cars I have owned over the years. (I am 40yrs old and have owned several Celicas, RX-7's, several SS Commodores, Triumph TR-7... the list goes on)

The teins are great, handling is excellent, but it isn't bone jarring when you hit bumpy areas on the road. The adjustability is also really good, you can feel the difference even 2 clicks make. Also the advantage of having height adjustability too. Which is the reason I had to get them in the end as I got done for having my MX5 5mm too low - the shocks had previously been replaced, but the springs had sagged.

Anyway, just my 2c worth.

I totally agree, love the Teins.

Having had Koni/king;koni/eibach and koni/standard springs my second choice would be Koni/Standard set at middle perch, which i found to handle well and ride great.

I disliked the ride with Kings and found the Ebachs great but too low.

Reag some of the overseas reviews I would be tempted to go KYB AGX's and standard springs as a economy set up.(AGX's can be brought in for under $470 at todays rate).If Ihad have kept the Italia that's what would have been going on it.

Peter

[Brad]

Prior to buying my Tein's, I compared the following:

Rebuild Clubman Bilsteins and add King Springs - $800
Koni and King combo - $1200
Avo and Kings - $1400
Tein's - $1600

I settled on the Tein's due the greater ride height and damping control, EDFC compatibility, build quality, local support, matched spring/damper setup and sheer bling

Very happy with them, though the chasie needs to be stiffer to get the most out of them.

[Richee]

The teins are great, handling is excellent, but it isn't bone jarring when you hit bumpy areas on the road. The adjustability is also really good, you can feel the difference even 2 clicks make.

I totally agree, love the Teins.

Peter

Hi Peter and ZenArcher

Just curious and sorry to Hijack but I have the following Setup
1990 NA
Tien SS with front and rear set at 12 out of 16
195/50/15 running at 32 psi

I am finding it great but it is really a tad hard esp. over the rough stuff and was wondering what setups you both have.

Thanks, Richard

[pcmx5]

Hi Richee,Just wrote a detailed response that the system has gobbled up so here is a shorter version!

I am running 32psi;9off hard front and 10 rear;this gives good ride/handling balance and everyone who rides/drives it comments on it.

Only time the rides is harsh is at slow speed on badly broken bitumen, so I just go faster!!

I was sceptical about Japanese suspension as there was a time when they thought hard=handle and given that all their roads were like billiard tables it worked to a degree for them but out here the tyres were constantly off the deck(bouncing) and the ride and handling were ordinary ..

Ted (on this forum)was involved with the development through Fulcrum of the Aus versions and his word was enough for me.

I am glad I listened!!

Enjoy,

Peter

[Richee]

Thanks for that Peter,

Only time the rides is harsh is at slow speed on badly broken bitumen, so I just go faster!!

Yep know what you mean.

Will adjust and head out for a spin.

Richard

[Babalouie]

I was sceptical about Japanese suspension as there was a time when they thought hard=handle and given that all their roads were like billiard tables it worked to a degree for them but out here the tyres were constantly off the deck(bouncing) and the ride and handling were ordinary ..

That's an accurate summation of the old school of Japanese coilovers, where superstiff was best. I remember driving a Skyline on old style Teins, and even down the straight at Wakefield it was bumpy! And I don't believe that there are actually any bumps on the straight in the first place

But the Tein SS and Flex seem to be a new generation which are designed for export, and hence not the billiard table roads of Japan. Some japanese brands are still overstiff but other brands like Aragosta are just phenomenal.

But don't write off the japan-spec Teins however. They might not be revalved for Aussie conditions, but the first ppl to rave about Tein SS on this forum were myself and CT, and we both have the Japan Teins, since the Aussie ones didn't exist at the time. The Aussie ones may ride better, but the JDM Teins are still a step above the usual Koni/King combination in both ride and handling...

[Fatty]

well this thread has turned into a total tein love fest !

i might as well add to the love then... i've had my tein SS for a month or so and as each day passes i love them more and more . i did a full suspension change, got the teins, superpro bushes and finally got a proper alignment. i did it all in one hit. so the feel of the car changed very dramatically and after a month of adjusting to the changes, i am only now starting to feel like i understand the car again.

initially i had them set 3 clicks off full hard. this was fine on the track at phillip island but it was just too hard on the road. every bump felt like a huge pothole. i changed them to 10 clicks off full hard for the drive back from phillip island, and it was sooo much better. the difference between the drive up (at 3 clicks) and the drive back (at 10 clicks) was like night and day.

so they have stayed at this setting and in the last week i have dríven some great twisty roads that i am very familiar with . (black spur and surrounds, and the great ocean road ). the car is much smoother on these roads now than it used to be. people talk about tiens being harsh but the opposite is true. the car just feels much more planted and it just soaks up the bumps. i can go a lot faster , yet feel much smoother and more in control. altho around town at slow speeds ( i live in a fairly built up area), yeah it is a little less comfortable than it was previously. but it's well worth the sacrifice.

i should probably continue to have a fiddle with the settings, try different setting s front and rear, stuff like that. but all in good time.

so yeah , two thumbs up for the teins.