Hi, been reading old threads on rollbars. Lots of conflicting info and plenty of debate!
Way I interpret the rules - NSW supersprints type 1 and 2 cars do not need a rollbar but can optionally do so. If the bar has CAMS certification you may (or not?) need to comply with a rule about helmet being 50mm under depending on the mood of the chief scrutineer.
If the bar is not certified then it depends on the mood of the chief scrutineer to deem your bar safe, however the ambiguous 50mm ruling does not apply.
Padding is not required in supersprints if the bar is not likely to come in contact with the drivers helmet (Brown Davis, mx5plus type bars) as they are far back from the seat and not over/around your head like a full cage. How to interpret that? I think in an accident/shunt your head can move a long way (seen plenty of crash test dummy videos! Though lap/sash, not race harness). I would think it prudent to add padding.
Also, what protection does the padding realistically provide considering the helmet is on your noggin? If it came to it, I'd be more concerned with a bit of soft top frame piercing my body somewhere. I'm hoping that helmet is money well spent.
On the helmet topic, what's the opinion on HANS for sprints? I heard it will be mandatory some time in the future. I find it very uncomfortable, but it is obviously good to have on should the worst come about.
Certification of the rollbar is only required if the car is logbooked. But then the 50mm head clearance requirement comes into play, and most drivers will struggle with that.
I agree that the ambiguity around BD rollbars is very frustrating - it's been that way for much longer than the four years that I've been supersprinting. A lot of it is open to the interpretation and judgement of the chief scrutineer. So much grey area! Padding of the rollbar is a good idea. SFI 45.1 padding is required by CAMS if it is judged that padding is necessary. My seat position is as far forward as the seat goes, and my head is nowhere near the rollbar - so far, I've not been asked to get it padded (although I've bought some anyway).
If you wear a harness then it is definitely recommended that you invest in a HANS device. They are only really restrictive to movement when you're parking. I don't even notice mine while driving on track.
I have just fitted SFI 45.1 padding to the Brown Davis in Britney in the areas around the driver, as in Canberra padding is compulsory for road rego, but if a roll-bar has padding then it must be compliant for the scrutineers (catch 22). It was better to upgrade the padding than risk rejection.
I have also had to get the softer padding cover as the hard padding allegedly doesn't meet rego standards.
The inconsistent rulings on roll-bars that fit under a hard/soft-top, but don't meet the requirement of the day are frustrating for all sports car owners. We have had hillclimbers remove their roll-bar as it was non compliant and they were then allowed to compete without any roll-over protection !!!!!
It is thanks to the efforts of Mike Hicks and others that we have been allowed to compete over the last few years.
YanMa YatTai wrote: On the helmet topic, what's the opinion on HANS for sprints? I heard it will be mandatory some time in the future. I find it very uncomfortable, but it is obviously good to have on should the worst come about.
I have just recently started using a hans device. Still optional for Vic club sprints but a good idea nonetheless. When you put it on outisde the car (as you need to do) it is slightly uncomfortable, strapping yourself in the car is then very uncomfortable. Waiting in the grid for your run to start is horriblly uncomfortable, yet by the second corner on track you dont even notice it is even on..
YanMa YatTai wrote: On the helmet topic, what's the opinion on HANS for sprints? I heard it will be mandatory some time in the future. I find it very uncomfortable, but it is obviously good to have on should the worst come about.
I have just recently started using a hans device. Still optional for Vic club sprints but a good idea nonetheless. When you put it on outisde the car (as you need to do) it is slightly uncomfortable, strapping yourself in the car is then very uncomfortable. Waiting in the grid for your run to start is horriblly uncomfortable, yet by the second corner on track you dont even notice it is even on..
I wonder if you are doing something wrong. What is causing you to feel uncomfortable?
I can put mine on in the car (but I don't usually), and I do not find it uncomfortable at all though when the restraint is hooked up it can restrict head movement. I usually leave doing up the restraints until sitting on the dummy grid, and do them up and tighten the seatbelts at the same time.
I agree that they become the new normal very quickly, and I adapted to mine so well that now I cannot think of a reason not to use it every time I use a harness.
rascal wrote:I have just recently started using a hans device. Still optional for Vic club sprints but a good idea nonetheless. When you put it on outisde the car (as you need to do) it is slightly uncomfortable, strapping yourself in the car is then very uncomfortable. Waiting in the grid for your run to start is horriblly uncomfortable, yet by the second corner on track you dont even notice it is even on..
I wonder if you are doing something wrong. What is causing you to feel uncomfortable?
the unit just seems to dig into my shoulders. It has 10mm thick padding but this doesn't seem to help much..
This looks far more uncomfortable than wearing a HANS:
I don't get behind the wheel of my car without it. First few times using it are a little awkward but once you have everything figured out it becomes second nature...like putting a seatbelt on when you get in the car.
Truthfully I do not find my HANS uncomfortable at all, no more pressure on my shoulders than my harness would give. Turning my head is restricted (not enough to stop me using mirrors) and I can't look at my feet (not that I need to) but other than that I don't know it is there. I think you are doing something wrong if it is painful to use.
Well, it's not like you 'can' do anything wrong. It sits on your shoulders and is held down with your harness. Not like you can get it backwards,twisted, upside down etc..
Obviously the curvature of the device is different to that of my shoulders. The harness follows the counters of my shoulders as its flexible, whereas the device is rigid, hence why it feels more uncomfortable. Not painfull, just uncomfortable.
But as I mentioned, after two corners I've forgotten it's on, so it could just be getting used to it.
I would check you have the right HANS - I think mine is 20 deg. You might also have someone (who uses a HANS) check you out while you are belted up with the HANS and see if they can see anything.
Yeah, mine is 20deg, as recommended for these cars. (think the 30deg is for open wheeler, and 10 deg is for sprint cars or something like that.) Its also a medium, which is what 85% of guys fit so definitely the right size. (Small wont go around my neck and large was too big)
yes, its scary seeing real world examples how much your head moves. A mate of mine hit a wall head on at 180kmh at SMP, and walked away with just two broken ribs. Doc said if he wasn't wearing his HANS, he wouldn't be here now..
Rascal that is a little odd, that it is that uncomfortable.
Would be worth checking it against another medium to see if the arms and shape of yours are the same, make sure it hasn't been distorted in an way in shipping or whatever.
