SP or SE

[Boyracer]

You guessed them all pretty spot on Casey...looking forward to building up the new toy.

[jolt]

Has anybody in Australia dyno tuned their SP yet?

If so, what are you using to do it and where did you get it done?

thanks
Rod

[Sean]

Has anybody in Australia dyno tuned their SP yet?

If so, what are you using to do it and where did you get it done?

thanks
Rod

Fasterdriver who used to post in here had a fair amount of tuning done by Silverwater Automotive services and yeilded excellent improvements, I can't recall the specifics, but it did include water injection.

Dave was looking into/testing teh SP motorsports/walkers ECU which was a modified version of teh stock one IIRC, he also saw some good results.

[yarnmx5]

so if the upgrade kit increases the SE to around 145kw, will the SP go up the same if a turbo dump/full exhaust / more boost is also done.

I am interested to hear from the SP drivers what they have done to get a few more (safe/reliable) kw from their cars. Is 150 rwkw acheiveable with basic breathing mods and slightly increased boost, say 12psi?

[Garry]

A safe 150ish rwkw is achievable running the stock hardware (turbo/dump pipe/intercooler/exhaust/injectors/fuel pump etc). All you need is a slight adjustment to boost pressure (up to around 9PSI) and the factory chip retuned (around $750). Changing to aftermarket fuel management, even more boost with stock hardware, some fueling changes and more $$$$ can see around 180ish rwkw.

[Russellb]

A guy hear in canberra fitted an aftermarket ECU and on STOCK boost made 170Kw at the rear wheels but ran out of Injectors.Still pretty good with no other mods

[jolt]

A guy hear in canberra fitted an aftermarket ECU

Any idea which aftermarket ECU it was that he had fitted?
Do you know who tuned it?
Was it controlling the variable valve timing as well?
Was it a complete replacement standalone ECU or a piggyback/interceptor style setup?

thanks in advance
Rod

[Boags]

I Have tried to stay out of this, but I would just like to add a few points, which I believe are obvious, but i might be wrong....

1. If you are talking about times around a racetrack - get an SP. They are faster. Any mods you can do to an SE to make it as powerful as an SP you can do to the SP and make it more powerful...

2. If you want a body kit, Leather, Bose, a car you have to work the power out of (in PT's words, you have to drive it, it doesn't drive you), then get an SE, they look better, it's true. More luxury interior, lower on the outside. There is no point spending money on Bose and Leather for your SP, that would be dumb.

So, what is your preference, a few seconds once every so often on the track and a smile when you leave the lights, or leather and Bose whenever you get into your car.

Chalk and Cheese, not comparible...

Boags

PS - i'm sure most people know which one i'd choose, i've never been a fan of leather

[jules]

To add to Boag's excellent points, it used to be that you could buy an SE and do the power upgrades and still be out of pocket for roughly same cost as a used SP.

I've seen SP's as low as 29k now, with most in the very low 30's so perhaps this comparison is now out the window.

Jules

[jolt]

... you can do to the SP and make it more powerful ...

The problem with the SP is that you are limited with what you can get out of them regardless of your other mod's because there is no definitive tuning solution at this stage because of the damn variable valve timing system which is unique to the BP-VE.

The beauty of the SE is that it doesn't have S-VT, so you can use any number of proven tuning solutions.

The only thing the SP has over the SE is a larger intercooler and a larger turbo, both of which are fixed VERY easily for a few thousand dollars. The other thing the SP has over the SE is the S-VT, which without a tuning solution is more of a curse than a blessing.

Whereas on top of other interior and exterior cosmetic pieces, the SE gets as standard:
- upgraded clutch
- upgraded shocks
- upgraded springs
- upgraded swaybars
- upgraded radiator (?)
- upgraded gearbox internals
- upgraded wheels
- upgraded tyres
- and ... drum roll please ... an LSD!!

I believe that you can't call a car a sportscar or even a driver's car without an LSD. I know I'd prefer to leave two black lines in an SE when taking off from the lights rather than just one from an SP ...

Rod

[npn4875]

I am interested to hear from the SP drivers what they have done to get a few more (safe/reliable) kw from their cars. Is 150 rwkw acheiveable with basic breathing mods and slightly increased boost, say 12psi?

OK, I'll bite.

What would I do with more power?? My SP is still exactly as it came out of the Mazda showroom, sticky tyres fitted, and it was the second fastest road car at QR at the NatMeet track day. Clubman and National circuit. Not even wheel aligment done! (which it needs, as my tyre temps were way up on the outside, cold on the inside) A Tien treatment and good alignment would surely improve it a bit more?

There were plenty of SEs there. An SE has a lot going for it, but out and out performance isn't one of them. The magazine review comments aren't really surprising are they? The SE power is the same as the current NC. It's a nice car, but not especially powerful.

Like I said before. I wouldn't mind an SE suspension/diff treatment on my car ;)

Mike

[Garry]

The problem with the SP is that you are limited with what you can get out of them regardless of your other mod's because there is no definitive tuning solution at this stage because of the damn variable valve timing system which is unique to the BP-VE.

Except that the tuners of the SP thought that the SV-T was a blessing as they could tune the cam to suit the turbo application and get much better drivability than they could with the NB8A they were working on originally.

The major limiting factor for ulitimate SP engine performance is the higher compression engine and the stock MX5 connecting rods. As I understand it the SE has lower compression ratio (hence the tardy off boost aceleration) and a stronger bottom end than the stock MX5 (hence SP).

The money you spend upgrading the SE engine to meet the SP performance levels could be put back into the SP suspension/body kit/wheels/diff so the SP still ends up a faster car and a better handler.

As I said before, this whole topic is pointless. He who has the most money to spend on mods gets the fastest car. It doesn't really matter what you start with as your base car, if you spend enough money on it it will win. Take BJ's car for example. It will cream any SP or SE and it started off as a stock MX5. So using all the SE supporters logic a stock MX5 is what everyone should be buying and doing a \"number of proven tuning solutions\" to get the fastest car.

And just for the record, the SP has an upgraded radiator.

There is no point spending money on Bose and Leather for your SP, that would be dumb.

No more dumb than getting the leather option in your SE. I dont understand your logic. I have leather and a stereo that sounds better than the Bose one fitted to the SE in my SP as do a fair number of other SP's. As for looks, I think the SE looks shite with that poxy square boot spoiler and those horrible wheels. And most seem to be that horrible Velocity Red colour that looks like faded pink in anything but direct sunlight. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder my friend.

[jolt]

Except that the tuners of the SP thought that the SV-T was a blessing as they could tune the cam ...

They were acutally able to tune it though ... please show me how you can get your SP tuned for subsequent aftermarket modifications, say more boost and/or a larger turbo? Honestly, please show me becaues that will help me out with my own car! My point is that modification of the SP after purchase is hindered by the lack of a proven tuning (ie: ECU/piggyback/interceptor) solution.

I didn't think about the stronger bottom end on the SE and the lower compression ratio, they're both good points and will help the SE yield a higher peak power and make it better suited to a larger turbo.

Thanks for clarifying the radiator point, I wasn't sure about that.

horrible Velocity Red

I love that colour and typically I hate red cars!! I guess it is in the eye of the beholder ...

Rod

[rjastra2]

Why bother with either? get a proper turbo motor installed in your MX5.... SR20DET

[Garry]

They were acutally able to tune it though ... please show me how you can get your SP tuned for subsequent aftermarket modifications, say more boost and/or a larger turbo? Honestly, please show me becaues that will help me out with my own car! My point is that modification of the SP after purchase is hindered by the lack of a proven tuning (ie: ECU/piggyback/interceptor) solution.

I'm not a tuner Jolt, how would I know. Talk to Lachlan Riddle at Chiptorque on the Gold Coast. He may have some ideas for you.