Would this be a successful product to design for Mx5s?

[stuart1]

Thanks once again for all the comments. However now im contemplating whether this is actually a good idea for my car. Last time i took my car to the track i was at wakefield and i managed to get up to 145kph on the straight. Im starting to think that my car isnt fast enough to need a serious wing, and the cost of doing all of this is starting to be abit out of my budget, as i would need to buy myself a hard top as well to maximise windflow to the back of the car..

Fraser.G...Don't be discouraged for having an idea..Simple inventions are the things that make millions, unfortunately this area is a little more complex but having said that we can buy all sorts on expensive hardware and mega hours to try and improve our lap times whereas a simple session with an experienced driver may help highlight problems areas in a few minutes.

A stop watch and a good seat of the pants feel are still some of the best tools we can have in club motorsport.

Enjoy your motorsport..

[StillIC]

Thanks once again for all the comments. However now im contemplating whether this is actually a good idea for my car. Last time i took my car to the track i was at wakefield and i managed to get up to 145kph on the straight. Im starting to think that my car isnt fast enough to need a serious wing, and the cost of doing all of this is starting to be abit out of my budget, as i would need to buy myself a hard top as well to maximise windflow to the back of the car..

If you intend to compete in CAMS sanctioned events your car will not pass scrutineering with driver activated ("non-fixed") aerodynamic devices attached. They have been banned since, well, for a long time. They are considered dangerous.

General Requirements, Schedule F, Point 1....
http://docs.cams.com.au/Manual/GeneralRequirements/GQ07-Schedule-F-2015-1.pdf

[Dan]

They are considered dangerous.

I thought it was just banned because it would be too effective and for people to implement it properly would cost a fortune.

The active aero on supercars like the 12C looks pretty solid

[NitroDann]

If your car relies on aerodynamic grip to stay on the track and you have a system which changes the grip level on the fly which you built at home, well, you can understand why it is banned in lower end motorsports.

[Dan]

If your car relies on aerodynamic grip to stay on the track and you have a system which changes the grip level on the fly which you built at home, well, you can understand why it is banned in lower end motorsports.

Yeh I can see it being a bad idea from that perspective as well, even some of the homemade wings that don't move make me nervous

[stuart1]

Thanks once again for all the comments. However now im contemplating whether this is actually a good idea for my car. Last time i took my car to the track i was at wakefield and i managed to get up to 145kph on the straight. Im starting to think that my car isnt fast enough to need a serious wing, and the cost of doing all of this is starting to be abit out of my budget, as i would need to buy myself a hard top as well to maximise windflow to the back of the car..

If you intend to compete in CAMS sanctioned events your car will not pass scrutineering with driver activated ("non-fixed") aerodynamic devices attached. They have been banned since, well, for a long time. They are considered dangerous.

General Requirements, Schedule F, Point 1....
http://docs.cams.com.au/Manual/GeneralRequirements/GQ07-Schedule-F-2015-1.pdf

Yes a long time indeed..Since 1967.

Is this car maker that started the ban?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chaparral_Cars

After all fixed wing failures had been happening for quiet a while at that time.

Or was the concept simply too quick for regulators at the time..

Which ever way you look at it aero inspired innovation has been around for a very long time.

[madjak]

Given the use of active aero in F1, specifically drag reduction systems, I think there is a future for it motorsport even at hobby level.

The CAMS rules only restrict active aero in certain classes not in schedule F which only states that the wing must be 'fixed' as in mounted securely not immobile.

I think if you design the active system to passively default to the high downforce position and only opens on full throttle then as long as the design is structural it would be very safe. No more dangerous than DIY splitters, lightweight rims or any other mod that is applied to our cars.

I'd also recommend the use of tethers in case of mechanical failure to stop elements shooting off from the car.

[Magpie]

[madjak]

Yes, there are failures of Aerodynamic devices on race tracks and it highlights how all wings should be tethered to the vehicle. However, there would be 10 x more offs due brake / tyre failures and 100 x more spins due to turbo power kicking in. Should we ban all devices that produce potential risk? Motorsport would get pretty boring.

The key here is that the design must be strong enough to handle the forces involved. Like any part that gets modified on a race car, it should be thoroughly tested before run at full pace and then checked periodically for signs of failure. If engineered properly there should be very little risk even with active aero.

[Magpie]

This is also why I'm having my wing mount(s) redesigned.

[madjak]

yeah I need to fix my uprights. Gotta get them a bit stronger... I'm just going to make them out of solid 6mm plates rather than the lightened versions I had cut. I have a tether on mine made out of 250lb SS fishing trace. Pretty easy to add and makes the wing a lot safer for spectators, officials and other cars.

I bet that wing failed due to the uprights twisting and fatiguing the alloy. A simple cross wire would help the side loading, however on an MX5 you can't open the boot with cross wires installed.

[Magpie]

Getting off topic....

My (current) plan is to:
1. Build mounts from the inside of the boot up to the underside of the lip around the boot. This way I can retain the current mounting of the wing.

2. A solid billet infill, that will allow water to drain past/around in the space between the boot lid and mount made in step 1 directly below the existing mount.


3. The existing base of the mount will be made longer so that it can be pinned through the boot lid and the infill billet into the mount inside the boot. Using something like this:

This will allow the pins to be pulled and the wing taken off so the boot can be opened. Further it will allow wire cross bracing to be installed as well as tether the wing if needed.

4. The existing wing mounts could also be modified for lateral strength/stability.